First Few Days - To mix with formula or not to mix?

Hi, just curious, is it the norm to give baby some formula to supplement in the first few days in hospital?

For my 1st born, was told that colostrum not enough by a nurse coz only "few spoonfuls, where got enough? etc etc...". It was an auntie, but since she was a nurse I believed her & issued instruction to feed my baby formula. Though periodically I did bf my baby.

However now when I do some more reading up, seems should not be the case? Just want some opinions/advise fr mummies here as I dont know if my decision then was correct or not. Anyways, end up my breast milk was quite low & I had to supplement with fm throughout during my 6 mths of bfing.

Now expecting 2nd one, so really want to succeed in total bf this time. But of coz not at risk to baby's health/nutrition...
 

diza

Member
Babies are born with reserves in their body and colostrum is enough to keep them full. After delivery, inform the nurse that u want TBF and insist only on cup feeding. They will definitely feed ur baby a bit of formula when they first bring him to the nursery after delivery. Just remember to tell the nurse not to bottle feed so as not to create nipple confusion. Then inform the nurse to bring baby back to ur room when he's hungry. This will help to establish ur supply. If u aim for TBF, do not give him FM after discharge, not even for one feed or mix feed. If u give FM, ur supply won't establish. Just nurse ur baby when he/she cries.. Feed on demand even when ur baby cries within an hour after last feeding session. U must inform ur husband and confinement nanny or mother that you want to TBF ur baby. Better still, don't buy FM. The moment u buy and store it at hm, chances are it will be given to baby.
 

diza

Member
Have u seen how big is the cup?? It's not the usual cup for crying out loud.. It's a very small container! I doubt babies can get choked by it and they let the baby sip not gulp it down. Many babies experience nipple confusion coz teats and nipples are not the same!
 
nipple confusion definitely exist. maybe u are one of the luckier ones whose baby dont have any of such problem.

my boy got nipple confusion with bottle teats and pacifier. no problem with nursing. so every baby is different.

cup feeding is one of the methods printed and shown in guidebooks circulating to new mummies in hospital, so definitely not nonsense at all.
 
For my 1st born, was told that colostrum not enough by a nurse coz only "few spoonfuls, where got enough? etc etc...". It was an auntie, but since she was a nurse I believed her & issued instruction to feed my baby formula. Though periodically I did bf my baby.
Sadly, it is often because of such ill advice (even from nurses who are supposedly 'trained') that BF attempts often fails for new mothers.
Frankly, alot of mothers from the older generation do not even BF and do not understand that babies need very little milk in the first few days.
Many atimes, the mothers and MILs will be telling the new mummies to feed formula as the NB is 'not getting enough' esp NB cries frequently. As a result, the mummies get so stressed up over the whole BF experience which is suppose to be so natural and instinctive.

It takes determination so insist on TBF in hospital even though it will be tiring but the results will pay off. Supplement if only no choice (e.g. BF jaundice) but even then ask for cup or spoon feeding.
 
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KiBin

Member
yes, i have heard hospital nurses, grand mothers, grand mother-in-laws all saying milk not enough stuff during 1st few days and make everyone stressful..

it's sad that only the true lactation consultants and very few people who read more will understand...

will be very hard during the 1st few days in hospital when everyone keep saying baby not drinking enough and you see baby not pooping..
 

pocus2000

Member
Breast milk usually only comes in after the first week, before that it's all colostrum and even so the volume can be too little even after a few days when the newborn's reserves are depleted.

Personally I feel that BF or breast milk is not a "must" and should not be treated as a "must" for babies. Even WHO recommends breastfeeding for 6months, "recommend" nia not die die must breastfeed.

Feeling stressed that you got no milk will only create unessesary stress on yourself and hence becomes a vicious circle cos Stress = lesser milk. more stress = lagi lesser milk.

And for babies with Jaundice, the best is to scheduled feeding instead of feeding on demand. This way the Jaundice can be quickly expelled from the stools and urine. If the baby is not well fed the jaundice will be worst cos jaundice babies are super sleepy and may wake up extremely hungry and underfeed. If your milk is not in yet you can't do scheduling feeding and formula is the alternative.

I feel that if your supply cannot meet the demands of the baby, just feed her formula first to tide her through. formula feeding at least you can control the volume. After that when you supply start coming in, you can BF or express for her to feed.

When my kiddo was out, my wife was stress over no milk. but we have not choice but to feed him formula. We started with 10% expressed breast milk(EBM) 90% formula for the first week. By the end of the 2nd week my wife's milk is more regular and we supply our kiddo 60% EBM 40% formula. Now after 3 weeks we are slow transiting to 80% BF/EBM and 20% formula. We aimed to be on 100% BF/EBM after the confinement lady left.
 
Sigh... Basically if mix formula. Baby may reject breasts becomes that the mummy needs to pump but not all women can get desired results just fr pumping alone. Meanwhile cl etc will stuff bb with formula increasing their size/appetite very fast so poor mummy no matter how hard she works can't catch up.

if totally dun mix what if baby is those impatient type or those big appetite bb? Feed and feed till both breasts super sore but baby still crying his head off. if latch too long the breasts wun recover. End up stressed mummy and hungry baby. Yah and elder ppl also love to comment that the bb not full enough.

guess really no txt book answer. Sianzzz....
 

KiBin

Member
Sigh... Basically if mix formula. Baby may reject breasts becomes that the mummy needs to pump but not all women can get desired results just fr pumping alone. Meanwhile cl etc will stuff bb with formula increasing their size/appetite very fast so poor mummy no matter how hard she works can't catch up.

if totally dun mix what if baby is those impatient type or those big appetite bb? Feed and feed till both breasts super sore but baby still crying his head off. if latch too long the breasts wun recover. End up stressed mummy and hungry baby. Yah and elder ppl also love to comment that the bb not full enough.

guess really no txt book answer. Sianzzz....
I think the idea is not to give up...

noticed that once breast milk stops, baby falls sick easier..

is this true?
 
Sigh... Basically if mix formula. Baby may reject breasts becomes that the mummy needs to pump but not all women can get desired results just fr pumping alone. Meanwhile cl etc will stuff baby with formula increasing their size/appetite very fast so poor mummy no matter how hard she works can't catch up.

if totally dont mix what if baby is those impatient type or those big appetite baby? Feed and feed till both breasts super sore but baby still crying his head off. if latch too long the breasts wun recover. End up stressed mummy and hungry baby. Yah and elder ppl also love to comment that the baby not full enough.

guess really no txt book answer. Sianzzz....
Totally agree there's no right or wrong answer as it depends also on the baby's temperament. Some babies can switch easily between the bottle and the breast (my boy was like that) while my elder gal hated the breast after being introduced to formula too early. Lactation consultant also commented that some babies develop a liking to taste of FM since it is sweeter than BM.

That's why i was determined to go TBF when I had my boy and got much better results.

Having said this, we mummies should not stress ourselves over BF. If can TBF, will be great. If for whatever reasons (lack of time or supply issues) can only do partial BF, then no worries as baby getting some BM is better than none.
 
yes, i have heard hospital nurses, grand mothers, grand mother-in-laws all saying milk not enough stuff during 1st few days and make everyone stressful..

it's sad that only the true lactation consultants and very few people who read more will understand...

will be very hard during the 1st few days in hospital when everyone keep saying baby not drinking enough and you see baby not pooping..

Really not easy for mummies trying to BF if the people around are not supportive and make insensitive remarks about supply not enough etc.
Worse stilll after BF is established, some even blame you if baby unwell or cranky cos it must be something that the mummy ate and passed on to the baby.
I remember once my boy who was on TBF developed rashes out of nowhere, the IL's reaction was "what did you eat" ? Sigh....
 

diza

Member
In my opinion, if u really want to go for TBF, do not supply with FM as it can disrupt ur supply unless you are very diligent to express milk when baby is feeding on FM.. Anyway, expressing is not as effective as latching coz babies are STILL the best "pump". The more u latch, the faster the supply will establish. Many moms who use FM are not able to fully BF their babies because from the beginning you have given a signal to your body that you do not need a lot of supply.. As babies grow older, their intake increases so it becomes even more difficult to meet their demand...

For babies with jaundice, feed on demand but you must make sure the baby feeds every 3 hour. Since BM is diluted and easily digested, babies may even feed every hour or so and may even keep on crying.. Never think that you do not have enough milk.. Nurse ur baby even when he/she suckles for comfort. As a NB, they always feels insecure. If latching calms ur baby, just let ur baby latch.

For the first few weeks, u may experienced cracked nipple.. I had that too and it was super painful but I kept telling myself that childbirth is more painful and I'm doing this for my baby. I never use any nipple cream.. I just rub my nipples using my own BM. It heals within a day or two. After a while, you will get used to it..
 
Just to share, I tried tbf this time round. However not positive result though I follow what the books say no supplementing with fm etc.

First 2 times pretty ok, baby latch well & pretty of colostrum this time. Even after he fed, I still have pretty much when squeeze all ooze out made me happy. By 3rd time onwards though soreness sets in. Start to have sharp pain each time he latch. After that each time more painful.

Was advised to change positions and latch shorter time. But it still got worse till I was screaming in pain whenever he latch. Finally even my pd told me to take it easy...advise that even if I persist my supply would go down due to pain, hormones will tell my body to make less.

Sure enough, now I end up with both painfully sore nipples & dreadfully low supply. Can say it's really dry...nothing comes out when I pump & hardly anything when I squeeze. Not able to latch anymore. Too painful & breasts already bled.

So, really depends. But I not giving up totally yet, still pumping hope for miracle & when my breasts recover somewhat hope to latch again. But if really cannot, then at least I say I tried my best....
 
I started with low supply n listen to CL advise to feed fm n bottle feed coz she is tired of carrying bb to me every night. After cl left im determine to build my supply. I pump every 2hrs n same as Pocus2000 method. Slowly reduce fm n finally bb is on ebm after 2 months. Don't b guilty if fm is given n give up bf totally. However, due to bottle feed. Bb dont latch well n alway doze off once she is latching to me. As my supply is able to meet her demand. I latch her in the middle of night to enjoy the bonding.
 
my only advise to you is to bring ur pump along. u'll feel really uncomfortable and tired to latch ur baby after a few times during the first day. so by pumping and latching, it'll help to increase your supply unless u jus so happen to be one of those who doesn't have much milk.
 

mrsred

Member
This might not be totally relevant here.. but I need some advice urgently.

I couldnt latch my no.1 so I am more determined for no.2 now. So far, latching not bad. But now that I'm home, my MIL says should give her water (in a bottle). I agreee because baby didnt wet her diapers, mostly poo only.

Will this lead to nipple confusion? We're using the new series of Avent bottles and teat.

Does baby really need water?

If she didnt pee much, does it mean that she's not drinking enough?

Makes me feel like trying to express and see how much I have and how much baby drink. But she'll drink EBM from a bottle and wouldnt that lead to nipple confusion still??
 
hi mrsred,

firstly, you might need to tell and explain to your mil that fully breastfeed baby do not need water. breast milk contains water so no additional water is required unless for babies feeding on formula, little water is ok.

how often does your baby feed? maybe try to wake him up if he doze off easily while latching, so he can drink more.

as for the nipple confusion. it really depends on how determine u are. some babies will have nipple confusion, some are very smart and they will overcome. mine develop nipple confusion between pacifier and bottle teats, but no problem with breast. and for myself, i am happy to be able to latch and feed thrg bottle freely.

but if i were u, i might try to bottle feed and also not to give up latching.

but up to u to choose:)
 

diza

Member
My mom, MIL and aunts also insisted on giving plain water when my boy was only a few weeks old coz they want him to pee often to get rid of bilirubin.. Told the doctor abt this and my mom was scolded coz it's actually not good to give babies plain water as their stomach is not strong to fight certain bacteria.. Google and read up for more info. Doctor said its ok to give plain water when baby starts to feed. But I do know that some mommies give a bit of plain water for FM fed babies coz FM is thicker than BM.
 
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